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Reading order for a first week here, and what to skip until later

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EngelhardtTL0New user8 Feb 2025#1

Reading order for a first week here, and what to skip until later Writing it up because I had to work it out twice and would rather nobody else did.

Trying to work out what would count as evidence on reading order, before collecting any. This is the part I usually skip and it is the part that makes the rest useful.

If two explanations predict the same observation, observing it does not help. So: what observation would separate them?

0 likes 18mo
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d.nilsenTL210 Feb 2025#2

On the reading order question specifically: start with the how-to-ask materials in this category, then read the one to three subcategories where your main questions live. The rest will be discoverable by tag once you understand the structure.

It is worth stating the boring hypothesis before the interesting one.

20 likes 18mo
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m.wanjalaTL1Member12 Feb 2025#3

Asking as the newest person in the thread: is there a canonical order to read the documentation set in? I have been going alphabetically and that is clearly not it.

5 likes 17mo
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f.ibarraTL213 Feb 2025#4

Where I would push back on the reading order consensus is the confidence, not the direction. The direction looks right. The confidence is borrowed.

0 likes 17mo
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g.haalandTL3Regular14 Feb 2025#5
d.nilsen, post #2: On the reading order question specifically: start with the how-to-ask materials in this category, then read the one to three subcategories where your main questions live. The rest will be discoverable by tag once you understand the structure. It is worth stating the boring hypothesis before the interesting one. Go to post

Reading order is worth one more sentence than it usually gets, and the sentence is the one about how the number was arrived at.

28 likes in reply to #2 17mo
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il.dumitruTL216 Feb 2025#6
Engelhardt, post #1: Reading order for a first week here, and what to skip until later Writing it up because I had to work it out twice and would rather nobody else did. Trying to work out what would count as evidence on reading order, before collecting any. This is the part I usually skip and it is the part that makes the rest useful. If two explanations… Go to post

The Lounge is a real category rather than a dumping ground. The sourcing rule still applies there, which surprises people, but the register is looser and nobody minds a digression.

It is worth checking rather than assuming, which costs nothing.

14 likes in reply to #1 17mo
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f.abrahamsenTL2Member17 Feb 2025#7

The moderation log is public. Every staff action is logged with the rule cited and the reasoning stated. If you get moderated, the explanation is there and it is worth reading even if you disagree with the action.

Somebody will have a better source than mine, and I hope they post it.

0 likes 17mo
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e.coelhoTL218 Feb 2025#8
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GDashwoodTL3Regular19 Feb 2025 · edited#9

Distinguishing three things in the reading order discussion that keep getting used interchangeably: the observation, the proposed mechanism, and the recommendation that gets attached to both.

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ca.haddadTL220 Feb 2025#10

An update on my earlier reading order post: the pattern held for another six weeks and then stopped, which I did not predict and cannot explain.

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endpoint_lineTL321 Feb 2025#11
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in.guerreroTL222 Feb 2025#12

Agreed, and I will stop repeating the version of this I had been repeating.

0 likes 17mo
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h.nicolaidesTL3Regular23 Feb 2025#13

I would rather this thread reach "we do not know" about reading order than reach a confident answer that nobody can support when asked.

1 like 17mo
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ca.vermeulenTL224 Feb 2025#14

On reading order, the part that usually goes wrong is that the question is asked as though it has one answer. It has a range, and the width of the range is the interesting bit.

If you can post the two or three numbers you are working from, several people here will check the arithmetic rather than argue about the conclusion.

7 likes 17mo
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glossary_lineTL1Member25 Feb 2025 · edited#15
in.guerrero, post #12: Agreed, and I will stop repeating the version of this I had been repeating. Go to post

The Lounge is a real category rather than a dumping ground. The sourcing rule still applies there, which surprises people, but the register is looser and nobody minds a digression.

That is my reading. Someone else read the same page differently and was reasonable.

12 likes in reply to #12 17mo
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z.vogelTL226 Feb 2025#16
Engelhardt, post #1: Reading order for a first week here, and what to skip until later Writing it up because I had to work it out twice and would rather nobody else did. Trying to work out what would count as evidence on reading order, before collecting any. This is the part I usually skip and it is the part that makes the rest useful. If two explanations… Go to post

The tag pages are usually a better entry point than the categories for a first read. A tag cuts across categories, so following one shows you how the same subject is treated by the analytical people and the practical people at once.

26 likes in reply to #1 17mo
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diluent_watchTL2Member26 Feb 2025#17

What would change my mind on reading order is a second dataset collected by someone with no stake in the first. Until then I hold it loosely and I would rather say so than pretend to more.

0 likes 17mo
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m.dumitruTL227 Feb 2025#18

The useful distinction on reading order is between what was measured and what was inferred from it. Both end up in the same sentence and only one of them has error bars.

4 likes 17mo
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ZieglerTL3Regular28 Feb 2025#19

Appreciated. The plain phrasing does more work here than a longer post would.

0 likes 17mo
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g.verhoevenTL21 Mar 2025#20

The Lounge is a real category rather than a dumping ground. The sourcing rule still applies there, which surprises people, but the register is looser and nobody minds a digression.

0 likes 17mo
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outline_firstTL3Wiki editor2 Mar 2025#21

Introducing yourself is fine and requires no question. Post in this subcategory, describe the context that matters for why you are here, and lurk for a bit before posting technical questions. That order works well.

7 likes 17mo
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c.castellanosTL23 Mar 2025#22

The Lounge is a real category rather than a dumping ground. The sourcing rule still applies there, which surprises people, but the register is looser and nobody minds a digression.

1 like 17mo
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cannula_traceTL3Regular4 Mar 2025#23

Adding the boring version of reading order, because the interesting version keeps getting posted and the boring one is usually right.

Check the ordinary explanations, in order, and stop when one of them accounts for what you are seeing. Most of the time the second one does.

0 likes 17mo
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g.amankwahTL24 Mar 2025 · edited#24
diluent_watch, post #17: What would change my mind on reading order is a second dataset collected by someone with no stake in the first. Until then I hold it loosely and I would rather say so than pretend to more. Go to post

Right, and stated more narrowly than I would have dared to state it.

25 likes in reply to #17 17mo
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BirkelandTL3Regular5 Mar 2025#25

Where I have landed on reading order, having got it wrong once in public: the direction is clear, the magnitude is not, and anyone quoting a precise magnitude has borrowed it from somewhere that did not measure it.

4 likes 17mo
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v.rautioTL26 Mar 2025#26
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citation_indexTL2Member7 Mar 2025#27
c.castellanos, post #22: The Lounge is a real category rather than a dumping ground. The sourcing rule still applies there, which surprises people, but the register is looser and nobody minds a digression. Go to post

Marked solutions are the site's way of saying that someone asked a good question and someone else gave an answer that actually worked. It is not a competition and it does not appear on your record — it is just how the site learns which topics stay useful six months later.

0 likes in reply to #22 17mo
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a.kravchenkoTL28 Mar 2025#28
diluent_watch, post #17: What would change my mind on reading order is a second dataset collected by someone with no stake in the first. Until then I hold it loosely and I would rather say so than pretend to more. Go to post

The compound and evidence pages are updated regularly and they are worth reading when you are new. They answer the meta questions like "do we have data on this" and "what do the trials actually show" before you ask them.

That is where I would start, not where I would stop.

18 likes in reply to #17 17mo
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dietitian_hollisTL3Dietitian8 Mar 2025#29

Speaking only to reading order as I have actually seen it, rather than as it is usually described: the effect is real, it is smaller than the thread suggests, and the variance between people is larger than the effect.

2 likes 17mo
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h.agyemanTL29 Mar 2025#30

A request rather than an answer: could whoever has the primary source for reading order post it? I have seen the claim three times this month and each version had lost a qualifier.

0 likes 17mo