Noted, and I have changed what I was going to do on the strength of it.
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Clinical · Special populations · continued
Adolescents: a distinct evidence base — one year on posts 31–60
This is a continuation of a long topic, addressed by post number rather than by page. Start at post 1.
Athletes and people in substantial training loads are effectively unstudied, and the questions asked here about performance have no trial evidence behind them at all.
It is the sort of thing that seems obvious in retrospect and was not at the time.
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titration_diary, post #28: Helpful, and easy to find again, which is half of what a good reply is. Go to post
I read post #32 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.
A request rather than an answer: could whoever has the primary source for Adolescents post it? I have seen the claim three times this month and each version had lost a qualifier.
r.mensa, post #21: I would call the community position on Adolescents likely rather than established, and I would be comfortable defending that hedge. Go to post
Post #32 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.
Extrapolating a point estimate to somebody well outside the enrolled range should be described as an extrapolation every time it is done.
a.jansen, post #27: Confirming post #26 from a second method, which matters more than confirming it from a second person. The failure mode on Adolescents is boring rather than dramatic. It is almost always the step everyone assumes was done correctly because it is too simple to get wrong. Go to post
Body weight at the extremes of the studied range affects exposure and the trials rarely reported enough to say by how much.
The evidence for this is thinner than the way I have phrased it suggests.
Post #35 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.
I changed my mind about Adolescents after someone here asked me for the source and I could not produce one. That is worth saying out loud because it is the ordinary way it happens.
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Collapsed as off-topic by two members at trust level 3 or above
Where I part company with post #35, and it is a narrow parting.
Nothing in this subcategory is medical advice and the questions asked here are precisely the ones that need an individual assessment.
k.haddad, post #12: I would rather this thread reach "we do not know" about Adolescents than reach a confident answer that nobody can support when asked. Go to post
Bookmarking this. I will come back when I have something worth adding.
The most useful contribution here is usually a citation to whichever published document comes closest, with a plain statement of how far it is from the question.
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c.falk, post #42: Worth separating Adolescents as a question about the compound from Adolescents as a question about the documentation. They get answered by different people and only one of them is answerable here. Go to post
I had written a reply contradicting post #42 and deleted it. Here is what survived.
The confident answers on Adolescents and the well-sourced answers are not the same answers, which is the most useful thing I have learned reading this category.
d.bramley, post #9: The arithmetic in post #7 is right; the assumption feeding it is the part to check. The reason Adolescents keeps being re-asked is that the answer is conditional and people quote it without the condition. It is not that the answer is unknown. Go to post
Adding the measurement that post #44 says would settle it.
Two things can be true about Adolescents at once: the mechanism is plausible and the evidence for the size of the effect is thin. Most of the argument here is people defending the first against attacks on the second.
Post #42 describes the usual case. This is about the unusual one.
Dedicated trials in under-studied populations are the only real remedy and several are ongoing, which is worth saying rather than speculating.
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Post-surgical populations, particularly after procedures affecting the gastrointestinal tract, interact with a delayed-emptying mechanism in ways that need specialist input.
A weak preference rather than a position.
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Extrapolating a point estimate to somebody well outside the enrolled range should be described as an extrapolation every time it is done.
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septum_entry, post #41: Bookmarking this. I will come back when I have something worth adding. Go to post
The claim about Adolescents upthread is stronger than its source supports. I have read the source. The source says "associated with" and the post says "causes".
My understanding of Adolescents is a few years old and may have been superseded. If it has been, I would genuinely like to know rather than keep repeating it.
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citation_peak, post #39: Where I part company with post #35, and it is a narrow parting. Nothing in this subcategory is medical advice and the questions asked here are precisely the ones that need an individual assessment. Go to post
The reason Adolescents is hard to answer is that the obvious measurement and the relevant quantity are not the same thing, and substituting one for the other is silent.
a.jansen, post #27: Confirming post #26 from a second method, which matters more than confirming it from a second person. The failure mode on Adolescents is boring rather than dramatic. It is almost always the step everyone assumes was done correctly because it is too simple to get wrong. Go to post
Dedicated trials in under-studied populations are the only real remedy and several are ongoing, which is worth saying rather than speculating.
I would put a moderate confidence on that and no more.
Adolescents: a distinct evidence base exists. The compounds are not approved for routine adolescent obesity but are being studied. Adolescent physiology and psychology differ from adults' in ways that matter for this medication class.
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s.chowdhury, post #48: Post-surgical populations, particularly after procedures affecting the gastrointestinal tract, interact with a delayed-emptying mechanism in ways that need specialist input. A weak preference rather than a position. Go to post
Adding a data point of agreement rather than a data point.